Revelation 12-13 Q&A
Here are some brief answers to our questions from our Sunday evening service. If you would like to discuss more, please call me or email at bruces@stphils.org.au.
1. Why is everyone saying Christians are being persecuted while Christians are known for persecuting other people and cultures throughout history?
I'd love to recommend another of John Dickon's books here - "Bullies and Saints - an honest look at the good and evil of Christian history". https://www.amazon.com.au/Bullies-Saints-Honest-Christian-History/dp/0310118360
This is a brilliant book that has this very discussion. We should be very aware that Christians have also been perpetrators of great persecution. In the present day, this is also still sadly true but not on the larger scale that it has been in history.
revelation is written to the Christian church of the 1st century during the first and major persecution of Christians by the "world" Roman Empire of the time. So it does speak to those being persecuted now of course, but it was written directly to the persecuted church since they were the ones being persecuted - so that's why we're mostly talking about the persecution of Christians (it is the context of Revelation)
2.Why does Satan keep trying to oppose God, when he has already been defeated? If he is a fallen angel, doesn’t he know that he is inferior to his Creator?
This is Satan's nature - to be the liar, deceiver, and tempter. He knows he is inferior (as a created being) but it infuriates him. He is evil. Looking at some leaders today, we can also see this - why do they continue to do evil when they are losing? Because they would rather be destroyed than be defeated.
3. In the bible why do you only look at it through God’s perspective and not Satan’s? As Satan could have a reason why he’s rebellious against god.
The Bible tells us that we have all rebelled against God. The Bible is God's word to us to show how to be right with him again - how to be restored. From our perspective or from satan's perspective, there is simply a desire to rule our own lives. That is sin - to be the King.
God's perspective is what the Bible gives us because it is the way out of rebellion against God.
Also... Satan's reason for his rebellion is the same as ours - we want to be King. The problem with that is that God IS King. He is the creator, sustainer, the life-giver and the one with power over all things. He IS King We ANT to be King Satan WANTS to be King. But he is not. We are not.
4. Is there mission work in Afghanistan or is it found to be too dangerous? What kind of mission work is happening? (edited)
Lots. Mostly, if not all, is under the cover of silence to protect those doing the work, and to protect God's people. The mission is happening nearly everywhere in our world but often we will not hear about it for the sake of people's safety. But in these areas, God is doing extraordinary work through his people.
Maybe you can consider your role in this?
Pray? Give? Go?
5. Why does the bible talk about dragons even though it is a figurative man-made creature?
I don't know much about the history of dragons. Some say they are completely mythical. Others say they were "mythologised" from other known creatures or that they were like the dinosaurs. (See the book of Job for some interesting creatures - were they mythical or "exaggerated" beasts from the earth or sea?). However, we can say that nearly every culture seems to have an impression of dragons as being fierce and untamed creatures. (Hence the need to "train your dragon". haha).
We may not know exactly why Satan is referred to as a dragon, but we do know it lines up with the other images of Satan -such as "the ancient serpent" (12:9). He is fierce and untamed, dangerous and frightening. But still no match for Jesus. I believe, also, that Revelation is the only book that uses "dragon" as a description of Satan.
6. Why hasn’t God wiped out Satan completely rather than let Satan continue to tempt us?
Revelation reveals to us that God is in control. He allows Satan loose but restricts him. Why? I can only say that for me, the work of evil draws me to Jesus. The problem of sin draws me to seek a solution. The fact that there is evil in the world reminds me that there is a problem. It's like when you get sick - suddenly you realise how good it is to be well. Satan is a constant reminder that this world is broken, that we are broken, and that we need a saviour. Personally I wish God would hurry up and end him, but His timing is perfect. His patience means salvation for those who have not yet turned to him.
But what Satan doesn't understand (because he is so fixed on his own rule) is that the presence of evil is often what draws people to the goodness of God.
7. The devil has been defeated but what stops a similar uprising in the new heavens and earth coming?
Because sin will be completely defeated. Like a virus that stamped out forever. Evil will be banished AND our hearts will be made new in the image of God, as they were once made. So there will be no "new virus" of sin. What we do know is that our redemption will be an eternal state, and we trust God that this is true.
8. Is v8-9 the main text to support the "fallen angel" picture in pop culture? Are there any others? (edited)
Yes. That's the big one. And 12:4 - "a third of the stars" indicating the size of Satan's "army of fallen angels" Also this one from Isaiah:
Isaiah 14:12
12How you have fallen from heaven,morning star, son of the dawn!You have been cast down to the earth,you who once laid low the nations!
Here he is referred to as the morning star. (A reference also used of Jesus in Revelation 22:16! See last week's Q & A). But he is still "fallen" from heaven", hence an angelic being. There are other references such as Job but Revelation is the clearest in describing him as a
"fallen angel".
9. In Rev until now, most visions are not physical earthly events. Why change now and what’s the importance of this differing/additional account of Jesus’ birth?
This physical event is revealed as a spiritual event. The physical birth of Jesus was attended by the dragon, seeking to devour the Messiah as soon as he was born. It was Satan behind the attempt by Herod to kill Jesus as a baby.
Revelation helps us to realise that we cannot always see the spiritual in our physical world, but it exists and is always present. There are great moments like this that put a very obvious physical event in the context of what is also happening spiritually.
10. Theoretically, if Lucifer repented, would God forgive and restore him?
There is nothing in Scripture that suggests angels can be saved. The Bible tells us very clearly that Jesus became flesh and blood to save flesh and blood. He became human to save humans:
Hebrews 2:14
14Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death—that is, the devil
We are different to the angels. We are not heavenly beings but are "lower" than heavenly beings. However, everything is placed under OUR feet, not the angels. Angels are servants of God, heavy beings who serve him.
Hebrews 2:6-7
6But there is a place where someone has testified:“What is mankind that you are mindful of them,a son of man that you care for him?7You made them a little lower than the angels; you crowned them with glory and honor
Angels are not human. Jesus became human to save humans. Humans alone are made in the image of God. We are the pinnacle of his creation and the ones called to live in a personal relationship with him. There is nothing about anges having anything like this purpose or even that they have a soul that can be "saved". Angles "long to look" into the things of salvation:
1 Peter 1:10-12
10Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, 11trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow. 12It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.
Satan cannot be redeemed. He was not created to be redeemed, and so is destined for eternal destruction.
Revelation 20:10
10And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
I for one am glad of this. This is God's justice, without which we cannot have eternal freedom and peace from evil.
Q & A is from 1:19:20